The Virtual Pub
Come Inside... => The Snug => Topic started by: GROWLER on May 26, 2010, 08:20:47 AM
-
Investigations are continuing into the cause of a crash which killed two schoolchildren and a pensioner.
Kieran Goulding, 15, and Chloe Walker, who was celebrating her 16th birthday, died when the bus taking them home from school hit a car on the A66 near Keswick, Cumbria.
Both youngsters were studying at Keswick School in the Lake District and were on their way home on a 49-seater coach on Monday afternoon.
The smash also claimed the life of Patrick Short, 68, from Braithwaite, who was behind the wheel of the only other vehicle involved.
Chloe was described as a "delightful" youngster whose tragic death came just three years after her brother Jordan died from the degenerative condition sanfilippo which he had battled since he was seven. Chloe should have been sitting her GCSE exams this week and planned to go on to study A-levels at the school's sixth form.
The coach they were on and the Honda Civic car driven by parish councillor Mr Short were travelling in opposite directions on a straight stretch of the A66.
Police said the "early indication" was the car had crossed the centre line of the road when it hit the coach which then flipped over. It is not yet known what may have caused 68-year-old Mr Short - children's services manager at Barnardo's Allerdale Children's Centre in Maryport - ( just how ironic could this be?) to cross to the wrong side of the road.
I don't mind admitting that this all did bring tears to my eyes.
I feel so desperately helpless for the parents and cannot even begin to imagine just how devastated they must be.
One of the worst cases of family tradgedy I've heard about for many years.
-
I agree, absolutely devastating for the families involved.
I have a serious question:
hypothetically, if say the teenagers, Kieran and Chloe turned out to have burnt down their local youth club the previous night how then would you feel about the tragedy?
-
Popcorn:
-
I agree, absolutely devastating for the families involved.
I have a serious question:
hypothetically, if say the teenagers, Kieran and Chloe turned out to have burnt down their local youth club the previous night how then would you feel about the tragedy?
Dunno tbh. Hadn't even crossed my mind.
The kids involved have gone and are no longer suffering. The parents, family and friends however have got to try to carry on regardless of what their deceased children may or may not have done, good or bad in the past.
No parent should have to go through the dreadful trauma of TWO of their childrens deaths over a peroid of 3 years, that's what I'm feeling particulary sad about.
-
Agreed Growler. I have tried over the years not to wrap my kids in cotton wool and consequently have had a couple of scares. I cannot even begin to know the anguish a parent must feel when a child of theirs dies. There was an incident many years ago when a girl (6/7) was abducted during the night from a caravan that the family were holidaying in. She was raped and murdered and was the same age as one of my daughters. Had me very upset at the time. surrender:
-
As many of you know my daughter died. I visited her grave last week. Worst thing that can happen, without doubt. And I haven't seen The Boy since February which is getting me down now.
-
As many of you know my daughter died. I visited her grave last week. Worst thing that can happen, without doubt. And I haven't seen The Boy since February which is getting me down now.
THAT needs to be sorted asap and as a matter of the greatest of urgencies over anything else Nick. Seriously.
Solicitor MUST sort out reasonable access NOW!!! Paramount importance.
All kids drive us mad, and regardless of what they get up to, normal decent parents love their own passionately even though we regulary feel like we are at our wits end sometimes.
I suppose I'm extremely lucky with mine.
Sometimes appauling beyond belief at home, BUT absolutely spot on towards others in the outside world, and for that I am grateful. I wouldn't have it any other way tbh.
-
Yep what he said Nick. It is seriously unreasonable and not fair on either of you.
-
I have paid a fortune to a solicitor who has written 4 or 5 times. No result.
-
I agree, absolutely devastating for the families involved.
I have a serious question:
hypothetically, if say the teenagers, Kieran and Chloe turned out to have burnt down their local youth club the previous night how then would you feel about the tragedy?
Further to that, I think it is highly unlikely that would have been the case.
Have you noticed how all the ratty scumbags of society seem to lead 'charmed lives' and live to a ripe old age, yet the really decent ones that actually offer something to society tragically and far too often, get taken away far too prematurely.
-
I have paid a fortune to a solicitor who has written 4 or 5 times. No result.
Phone call for IMMIDIATE response as to what he is going to do about a totally unreasonable and quite frankly cruel and intolerable situation, or you contact the Ombudsman...or whatever the govening body is called these days.../Citizens Advice immidiately...meaning today if not right now.
This situation of no access is bang out of order, and probably illegal on some sort of way?
-
You have a PM
-
David Cameron will be no use whatsoever. whistle:
-
evil:
drumroll:
-
You have a PM
Answered, only I don't know why you didn't say it all on here?
-
I agree, absolutely devastating for the families involved.
I have a serious question:
hypothetically, if say the teenagers, Kieran and Chloe turned out to have burnt down their local youth club the previous night how then would you feel about the tragedy?
Further to that, I think it is highly unlikely that would have been the case.
Have you noticed how all the ratty scumbags of society seem to lead 'charmed lives' and live to a ripe old age, yet the really decent ones that actually offer something to society tragically and far too often, get taken away far too prematurely.
Aye, only the good die young. noooo:
-
I agree, absolutely devastating for the families involved.
I have a serious question:
hypothetically, if say the teenagers, Kieran and Chloe turned out to have burnt down their local youth club the previous night how then would you feel about the tragedy?
Further to that, I think it is highly unlikely that would have been the case.
Have you noticed how all the ratty scumbags of society seem to lead 'charmed lives' and live to a ripe old age, yet the really decent ones that actually offer something to society tragically and far too often, get taken away far too prematurely.
Aye, only the good die young. noooo:
Most of us should live to a ripe old age then.
As for the original question ~ Too sad for words.
-
My heart goes out to the families and all those who knew all three killed in this accident.
Yet another tragedy, life can be so cruel, we should all count our blessings
-
My heart goes out to the families and all those who knew all three killed in this accident. As most of you know part of my duties include attend fatal or possible fatal RTI's. I've attended hundreds over the years and each one has a different story. Without doubt the ones that stick in the mind are those where children are involved, fortunately they do seem to be infrequent these days
Despite being hardened to these things, there are times when it gets to you. Twice I have had counselling, the first was to do with a particulalrly nasty accident scene, the second wasn't to do with the scene but to do with the circumstances surrounding it. A lady had had twins two weeks earlier, it was just before Christmas, she was suffering from post-natal depression and decided to throw herself in front of motorway traffic in the early hours. One husband deprived of his wife, two children deprived of their mother, a mother and father of their daughter, and many others affected too. At some point that poor man will have to tell his children what happened, how the hell do you begin to do that?
Yet another tragedy, life can be so cruel, we should all count our blessings
Agreed JOM was in the police force many years ago, saw and dealt with the results of a child going through a windscreen she had been sitting on her mothers lap. Mother and father both survived. They were not bad people just did something stupid as we all so sometimes. I can't begin to imagine what their life has been like since. noooo:
-
And I haven't seen The Boy since February which is getting me down now.
Nick, as others have said... sort it
I rarely talk on here about my girls. My ex and I had a really messy divorce many moons ago now. Everytime I went from Hampshire to Shropshire/Cheshire/Manchester/Liverpool to see them I was either rung beforehand or met at the door with a new excuse each time, "they're ill", "they don't won't to see you", "they're at their grans/aunties" etc etc. Four and a bit years of that crap, not seeing them despite solicitors being involved. It hurt a bloody lot then and it still hurts now. It came to a head when my eldest by then 14 years old knocked on my door in tears, my little girl last seen when 9 was then a blossoming young lady of 14, I'd missed those years for all three girls, I'll never get them back. Don't let it happen to you
-
I always find it difficult to contribute to a thread such as this; one or two of you may understand why already. Whenever I hear or read of children dying in an accident or worse an intentional killing (remember the Beslan massacre?) it chills me to the bone. I feel for the parents enormously and also the siblings that are left behind that have to somehow cope with the awful bereavement.
As to understanding how the families will manage; it will be sheer, utter, inexplicable bloody hell. When my elder brother died along with three of his school chums it nearly destroyed four families - eight parents and five siblings. There was little concept of counselling then, just Valium or whatever it was called which I think my mother was on for around a couple of years. The siblings including myself were traumatised for life; it's not something you get over but rather have to learn to live with as competently as you are able.
Quick and immediate action in the form of care and counselling will, I believe go some way to ameliorate the deep emotional and psychological wounds that will inevitably leave scars. It's awful, there's no other word for it and I can only hope that they receive as much support as possible.
-
Seems like there is an awful lot of us here that are aware of the pain and the impact this can have on people you love. Don't give up on your boy Nick - ever.
Speaking as someone that did not really know too much about their own dad ( mum left him when I was 3) I found out an awful lot more information in my later years about exactly how much effort he had been too to try and keep in contact. For whatever reasons my mum had she just tried to blank him out of our lives.
I met him again when I was 18 and I completely didn't know how to handle the situation . There was a man in front of me that obviously still loved me and I felt nothing and numb and completely ill equipped to deal with the situation.
He died a few years later and he left me a legacy of letters he had written to me over the years . One of the most heart breaking days of my life so far was reading those and wishing I had had another chance.
I know the Boy is a little older but he needs to know you are still there and fighting his corner
xxx
-
I am werking on it and HOPE to be taking him out for the day on SUnday sad24:
-
Fingers crossed for you Nick
-
Thanks Ms B and all others. A new and further possibility has just arisen
-
Have him for the whole of half term?
-
Thanks Ms B and all others. A new and further possibility has just arisen
Ship him to Cyprus...? rubschin:
-
It shouldn't be HOPE. It should be a right, YOUR RIGHT!
All bang out of order this, basically using kids as pawns. Makes my bloody bladder boil beyond belief. cussing:
-
Indeed but it happens all the time. Hell hath no fury like, in this case, a Mrs Nick who thinks she has been scorned. Any weapon will do but the best weapon will be the one she knows will hurt the most and that is what she is using.
Nick is well able to go round there, break down the door and carry the child off and then spend the next few weeks dodging the cops until he is arrested, banged up and forever barred from seeing the child.
That is the reality of how the system works.
Impossible for him to do anything other than try the legal route and hope.
Or I suppose he could dress up as Superman and sit atop the Liver Building with a banner calling for Rights for Fathers and then get arrested, banged up and be forever marked down as a nutter who could not be trusted and thus not allowed near the Boy.
Yes mate it boils my piss too but that's the way it is. Life is often shit!
-
Indeed but it happens all the time. Hell hath no fury like, in this case, a Mrs Nick who thinks she has been scorned. Any weapon will do but the best weapon will be the one she knows will hurt the most and that is what she is using.
Nick is well able to go round there, break down the door and carry the child off and then spend the next few weeks dodging the cops until he is arrested, banged up and forever barred from seeing the child.
That is the reality of how the system works.
Impossible for him to do anything other than try the legal route and hope.
Or I suppose he could dress up as Superman and sit atop the Liver Building with a banner calling for Rights for Fathers and then get arrested, banged up and be forever marked down as a nutter who could not be trusted and thus not allowed near the Boy.
Yes mate it boils my piss too but that's the way it is. Life is often shit!
I know, I know I know. That's what's so frustrating, and the laws need changing...... fast.
P'raps this new administration will finally look at this serious problem, and actually do something about this intolerable situation.
As you rightly say, many wimmin do all this just to spite the father, without a second thought for the damage they are doing to the child/ren. Downright bloody evil.
I had some of this shite when I split up from Mrs G#1 back in '78, but only to the extent that I was given strict times for pick up and return, and initially from the bottom of the road.
Made to feel like some sort of friggin' criminal.
-
My two were 15 and 17 when Mrs S#1 and I split. Access had to be on her terms. I was allowed to arrive at 0900 on a Saturday morning and collect them from the kerb outside the house. I had to return them at 9pm. This took much negotiating, financial arrangements and a Judge's order to achieve.
WTF was I supposed to do with them? They had no interest in spending a day with me. My daughter, bless her, used to make jokes about "How many McDonald's Happy Meals does Mum think we can eat?" and if it was raining she would say "Can we go to the zoo?"
In the end the boy used to get me to drop him off at his girlfriend's house (Well dad, that's what you would be doing if you still lived with us") and the daughter and I would mooch around every bloody country house and museum in Beds, Bucks and Oxon. After about 6 months of this nonsense the boy moved in with his GF (he had reached 18) and the daughter became such a fvcking pest to her mother's love life that the not yet ex phoned the Mrs SBB and asked her if she could send the girl to live with us for 6 months "Before I strangle her".
Next thing we knew was that the boy split with his GF and he too moved into our flat so I ended up with both of them for the next three years on and off until one then the other got married.
Strange thing is that whenever (at family occasions) I happen to meet the ex she always gives me to strongest hints that she would not be averse to a bit of hanky panky in the car/nearest hotel or behind a tree if necessary. It seems that she fancies me now that we are apart more than she ever did when we were together.
Wimmin?????? Shrugs:
-
Back to the original topic, I mean, just how dreadful must it be to lose your only two children in the space of just two years?
I really really cannot begin to even imagine just how absolutely devastated they are.
Just how bad can someones luck.....for want of a much more suitable word...actually be?
I don't know these familes, but I tell you I feel so so sad and helpless for them.
I can't even bare to look at the pictures of these two children anymore.
Give them strength to carry on, as I don't know if I could given the situation tbqh.
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/uk_news/england/cumbria/8705788.stm
-
Right. My big sis is on her annual family week in Filey. Most of her 17 grandhildren ( eeek:), beach hut, donkeys, sandcastles, fish'n'chips, more donkeys, scooters, wetsuits, boating, beach cricket etc. Kids all muck in together. Adults cook and take turns to keep an eye.
Me and The Boy are invited.
Mrs Nick says NO. She is taking the Boy into werk with her instead. I fucking despair.
Once I have sorted out my move it will be court
-
Seems like you have no other option unfortunately noooo:
-
Getting a court order regarding access is the easy bit ~ Persuading the other party to comply or getting anyone to enforce the order is the hard part. Good Luck!
-
Nick, sorry to hear that, sadly, a familiar story
I'm sure you already are, but keep records of every attempt you make to make contact, be it letter, phone or knocking on the door. People have convenient memory lapses when it comes down to sorting things out and it will help in proving that you have made the effort and that you were blocked in those efforts on a repeated basis. Best of luck
-
Oh I am JOM. And so is my solicitor.